i was chatting to a local at borth and he was saying that they were going to build a false reef at borth

does any one know any more about it

and what are the implications of the reef to our wind surfing

will it be like maui with there reefs or is it more for the still water jet skiers?

all the best dazzamuffin

Hi Darren,
They are 'thinking' about it and there have been chats and a few public meetings about the sheme (there was one this week), but nothing is definate yet.

The local surfers wanted one thinking it would improve the conditions, so Borth Surf Club was pretty much set up to campaign for the artificial reefs to be built. They got in contact with kerry Black who runs a company that designs and builds artificial reefs and after visiting Borth (and going for a surf here) he decided that Borth and it surf could benefit from such a scheme...But then he would say that as he wants to get the contract to build them.

Obviously the council wouldn't spend however many millions it costs to build these things just to improve the surf conditions, so the surf club and other campaigners for the reefs are now looking at it from a sea defences point of view and saying that the reefs would help reduce coastal erosion.
The environment Agency don't really sea coastal erosion as the primary threat to Borth, but are more worried about the risks of flooding and would rather sea money being spent on flood defences than coastal erosion defences... The debate continues and I haven't heard what happened at this weeks meeting yet.

As far as windsurfing goes...its likely that the reefs (if they were built) would be built further south along the beach than where we normally windsurf so there would be little direct effect. Of course, further South there would be a lagoon formed which would have flat water for about 100-200 metres and then a 'reef' where the waves would break. Pretty good for windsurfing then, but the reefs would probably be exposed and dry at low tide (not quite so good). The surf would be improved, but you still need swell to make the waves good for surfing and no matter how much you alter the sea floor topography, without the groundswell you won't get 'world class' waves. As far as I am concerned it would improve the quality of the waves, but not the consistency.

I also think that everyone involved needs to think about the implications of such a scheme.. The reefs 'basically' work by placing sandbags in the desired location and the sandbags then baffle sediment moving along the coast by longshore drift so building up an artificial reef that eventually becomes maintained by natural processes. This has to affect the sediment dynamics of the bay and sand build up in one location has to lead to another area becoming impoverished. With quite a few so called 'fragile' ecosystems in the area (Ynslas Dunes, Aberdovey Estuary, Borth Bog etc.) there needs to be a proper unbiased Environmental Impact Assessment carried out...

Anyone who regularly visits Borth has to know that the sediment dynamics of the coast are complicated and unpredictable. This year has proved this point, as in many areas sand has been removed to expose the fossil forest in areas of the beach where it hasn't been seen before.

I'm all for the building of artificial reefs if it will improve the surfing and/or windsurfing conditions, but there would have to be proof of significant improvements to outweigh the possible negative effects... Don't forget, one of those negatives effects would also be increased publicity and more 'tourists' on the beach...We don't want it to get too busy!!

Al.

I'm sure nothing like the building of an artificial reef will happen. This is something that costs millions. And who would be willing to invest that? What return would there be for a potential investor? Better surfing conditions for a few individuals? Come on guys, you can't be serious about that!

Joe

You're right Joe, they aren't gonna spend millions just for the surfers, but they are likely to do something as far as sea defences etc. go at Borth...The latest indications seem to suggest that they are more likely to build a big concrete breakwater type structure that won't appeal at all to the surfers and windsurfers, but would appeal to the Jet skiers...

The councilers and other decision makers also seem to think that Borth could then have a marina and it would attract well-off sailing types.

Of course such a structure costs more than artificial reefs, and nothing has been decided yet... I'll try to find out more about what happened at last Friday's meeting.

Al.

The figures thrown around at the meeting were, I believe, 10 million for the rock wall (this is what the council want), as opposed to three million for the reef. There are a few options knocking about, but the money is already in place and they are going to do something in the next five years. What would you guys rather have, a jet ski park or the reef?

I know...I know.... How about a reef made out of jet skiers!! Thats what i'd like to see.

Al.

thank you for the explaination al
looks like its gonna be jet ski heaven
my wind surf gear is up for sale now its time to become a jet ski dude (NOT)

well theres still rosniger to go to if they do mess things up

later daz

Rhosneigr might be OK for you, but I'm about to buy/build a house in Borth!!!

don't think it will affect the Golf Course Car park area though whatever they do.

Al.

what is it with artifical reefs ? ? first newquay, then bournmouth now borth ? ?

sounds to be like consultants cashing in, or maybe I'm just a big sceptic ? ?

there must be a big eu grant for them

al builds a house in borth great some where to stay every one

if they build a sea wall then it will stop the swells hitting the beach? surely this would affect the golf course area as well?

there must be a big eu grant for them

al builds a house in borth great some where to stay every one

if they build a sea wall then it will stop the swells hitting the beach? surely this would affect the golf course area as well?

Just before Al invites everyone to stay I think I should remind him that as he's getting a beach room to keep all his toys in, then as long as he can find room for any windsuring pals in there as well they can stay....no sand in my new house!

but sand is so much nicer than carpet.....

cheaper too, just sweep out Al's van once a week

First up... Doesn't everyone stay here anyway, even though the house isn't on the beach!!


Darren said:

quote:

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if they build a sea wall then it will stop the swells hitting the beach? surely this would affect the golf course area as well?

---

I think you've forgotten Al, if we build the house we can't afford carpets so maybe we'll have to go with the sand option!

You're right Al, as far as I understand it that's exactly what they're proposing to do. It might end up looking like the rock walls down at Aberarth, which look pretty bloody awful. I think they're planning to extend it to the end of the houses. Another key issue is the disruption to the village. The rock wall would obviously cause a lot of disruption, whereas the reef would be delivered by sea (giant hinged boat). It'll be interesting to see what eventually happens. Personally I think it would be a shame to see the break at the lifeboat station go.

i thought when you said a sea wall that it would go out at right angles to the beach.

so are they looking at making borth in to a little fishing village with its little harbour.

hope not

much prefer the reef idea.

Looks as though momentum is gaining for the reef idea.

Kerry Black (the guy who runs the artificial surf-reef building company) was in Borth again last night and had a meeting with the local surfers in the Friendship.

I couldn't make the meeting myself, but will try to find out what was said and let you know here. If anyone was there and can give us the details first hand it would be appreciated.

I spoke to Richard last night who has helped organise the meetings with Kerry Black and he siad they were going to discuss what sort of take off and what sort of wave we wanted!!! Cool hey!

Al.

OK...I've managed to get some sketchy information about the Artificial Surf Reef at Borth.

Kerry Black the CEO of ASR LTD. was in Borth last night and has been commisioned to carry out a feasibilty study of the idea. He has 6 months to carry out this study, but hopefully we'll start seeing the results sometime in May. Kerry has been having meetings all day today with the local authorities and other decision making bodies in the area as part of this study and should soon be carrying out detailed coastal sediment dynamic and environmental impact assessment studies.

Obviously, I know nothing about the priorities of the decision makers on this. I'd like to think that they will be looking at the cost/benefits of all psosible coastal management schemes from all angles, including actual costs, longevity of any scheme, effectiveness, environmental and ecological implications, financial benefits to the area such as increased tourism, effects on the local community etc etc... And of course just how good a wave they can create!!

So, hopefully, if Kerry Black can prove that the reef idea will provide a long-lasting, effective answer to coastal protection in Borth, whilst having little impact on the local community both during and after its construction. And that it is the most cost effective solution and will have the least effect on the local and regional environments and ecosystems...AND provide positive benefits such as increased revenue for local businesses and an improved wave. Then it will get the go ahead...But of course, its a long and convoluted road that such major planning decisions take.

I'll keep you posted when I know more.

For now.. Heres the link for ASR - Kerry Black's company

And I haven't been able to find much pertinent info from the local County Council yet, but I have found this document outlining the Shoreline Management Plan It seems a little out of date to me though as they only have 'No economic alternatives' listed for any Possible Alternate Policies....

If anyone can find any more up to date info from Ceredigion Council or any details of proposed plans then please post a link to them here.

Al.

I was at the meeting in the Friendship. The idea is to put a large sandbag as a sea defence/reef just offshore just up from the RNLI slip. This way hopefully the natural reefs and cliff wont be affected nor the bit under the cliff which we need when its howling and us surfers need a bit of shelter. The wave created may well be 100m long! Sounds excellent but when it came to discuss the type of wave, people wanted more, much more than they could handle ...spitting, sick, thick lipped throwing waves ..oh yes we're all up for that ...then we wake up and realise only a few can even surf the peak at Trap!!!

Thanks for that Amos... Sound like the local surfers were getting carried away as usual. They also have to remember that the primary reason for putting a reef there in the first place would be for coastal protection. The 'improved' wave would just be a bonus of this particular coastal protection scheme.

Al.
P.S. If you speak to Kerry, can I have a right-hander with a nice easy take off that then steepens up providing a nice little barrel, before backing off a little to allow for some nice cutbacks!!

Just found this articleby Alex Maeger which gives a review of the current UK artificial reef scene: (its quite long, but gives some good background info)

quote:

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The UK Artificial Reef Scene


The topic of artificial reefs can be broken down into three main areas: 1, coastal defence; 2, biological enhancement; and 3, recreational enhancement.



1, there are presently no reefs, or submerged breakwaters as they are also known, being used as forms of coastal defence along the coastline of the UK. The closest we have to reefs in the UK are water piercing rubble-mound breakwaters that are submerged only at spring high water but these are far from being true reefs.



Water piercing breakwaters have been the preferred form of offshore defence by companies whom have tendered for work in the UK until now. There are several examples of breakwaters being used at present with varying degrees of success. An oceanographer from one of the major UK coastal engineering consultant said, when asked to comment on the issue of submerged breakwaters, ?¨we need proof that they work as a form of coastal defence from someone other than the only company in the world that design them?Æ. At present ASR Ltd. (ASR), of New Zealand, are the world leaders in the market of multifunctional artificial reefs. The feeling conveyed by this employee was that they, as a company, would like to design reefs but unfortunately they do not have enough information to do so.



2, a better-recognized scene has been established for reefs being used for biological enhancement. Such reefs are easier to design because they are usually located in water with less wave-induced forces. They are placed to encourage marine life in both volume and diversity. A leading figure in this field is Dr Antony Jensen who is a lecturer at the Southampton Oceanography Centre and is also the coordinator of European Artificial Reef Research Network (EARRN). Dr Jensen, and an associate, has pioneered the use of waste materials for the construction of artificial reefs for biological enhancement. There have been two such reefs constructed in Poole Harbour, England, one made from tyres and the other made from concrete with a pulverised fuel ash additive. These reefs have been monitored over a period of time to check whether any toxins have leached in to the water and are showing encouraging results.



The Scottish Association for Marine Science (SAMS) has established another project in Lock Linnhe, Scotland. This development consists of six or more different clusters of concrete blocks and is being used to research many different aspects of biological enhancement. The latest progress report from this project indicates that, although the water is cold and murky, the reef is showing promising signs of biological enhancement.



Reef Balls are a very popular method of encouraging marine biology in other countries with many examples of their success in Florida, USA, and the Caribbean. Reef Balls have also been used in the UK but in numbers far less than those used in the USA. There is a project where some reef balls have been installed in a London Canal and also in an aquarium somewhere in England. Dr Jensen has also done some tests on reef balls but this is about the sum total of work done on reef balls. There is a report that some rouge reef balls have been deployed without permission at a location in Scotland but this story cannot be verified.



There is also a proposal that decommissioned oil rigs in the North Sea be used to generate an artificial habitat for marine wildlife. This technique has been used successfully in the USA to both enhance marine life and create a diving amenity. There are, however, a few problems with implementing the idea in the UK: a, fishermen have been promised they can fish the rigs once they are decommissioned; and b, the North Sea does not have a great recreational appeal to divers and hence any project would be strictly limited to biological enhancement.



3, the artificial surfing reef scene in the UK has been led by the crusader David Weight. The idea of manufacturing reefs for surfing purposes came to him after he realised that the Dorset coastline would be a perfect setting to use reefs for coastal defence; not only are long stretches of beach littered with groynes but there is also a small tidal range. Both these factors lend themselves perfectly to reefs.



David first put pen to paper in 1993 in response to a television programme that highlighted the problem faced when disposing of tyres. Although there was no positive response from this lead it turned out to be the first step on a path that has led the UK into a position where there are now plans for two artificial surfing reefs.



David then decided to write to the Bournemouth Council engineers since Bournemouth is probably the best place for a reef to be built in Dorset. He put forward a proposal for a reef made of tyres that would be designed to produce surfing waves. This, again, came to a dead end but the debate that it stimulated was useful. It became apparent that the engineers did not like reefs, because they were not a proven form of coastal defence, and that they did not like tyres, because of the threat that they posed to the marine environment. It just so happened that at this time Dr Jensen was starting his research into tyre reefs.



After receiving a couple more discouraging letters David decided to drop the activist stance and research the subject for his own personal interest. It was apparent at this time that none of the leading coastal engineers in the UK were interested in surfing and hence no research was being done in the UK on the subject. Finally, in 1997, the 1st International Surfing Reef Symposium was held in Sydney and David realised that there were other people in the world that shared the same interest. David politely asked his employers, Currie & Brown (C&B), an international company of construction consultants, to purchase the proceedings of this conference and he started to liase with colleagues to initiate a multifunctional artificial reef scheme. Proposals were drawn up for various projects around the south of England and some research was conducted through a student at MSc level. Whilst the proceedings of the conference had broadened the knowledge base of those working at C&B there was still a lot of research that needed to be done. David realised this need for research and approached some of the larger companies and organisations in the country. Unfortunately no one in the UK wanted to fund any such research and, with no research, there was no chance of any progress. With neither the government or any major companies in the UK interested in artificial reefs C&B had to pull out as well.



In the mean time Professor Kerry Black, from The University of Waikato, New Zealand, had the facilities and resources necessary to do the much-needed research and he managed to turn artificial surfing reefs into a viable product. This intensive period of research, known as the Artificial Reefs Program, furnished Professor Black with a portfolio of papers that established how to design an artificial reef for both surfing and coastal defence purposes. Professor Black then collaborated with some of his highly qualified colleagues, whom are also experienced surfers, to form the company called ASR Limited.



David, back in the UK, was in the familiar situation where his interest in artificial reefs had become a personal crusade. He had now developed proposals for several sites around the UK with one of them being at Newquay. He submitted the proposal to Newquay Council but unfortunately it was refused on the grounds that the technologically was unsubstantiated. Fortunately though, in the previous round of developments with C&B, David had gained a contact with the government??s regional engineer for the south west of England. This engineer, who was environmentally aware, saw some of the benefits that artificial reefs could offer to the environment and to the community. He suggested that David put a proposal forward for a reef at Bournemouth using ASR as the consulting engineers. A proposal was drawn up, ASR showed interest, and a presentation was arranged to put the idea forward to the Bournemouth Councillors. The response to the presentation was mixed: the people from leisure and tourism liked it; the local residents did not like the idea of attracting surfers to the area; and the council engineer did not want to use reefs as a form of coastal defence. On leaving the meeting it was suggested that an external report be commissioned to determine what effect a reef would have on the coastline in order to determine whether or not a reef would be a good form of coastal defence. This report was returned with a neutral response that left an open opportunity for ASR to prove that the reef would have no detrimental effect on the coastline. The residents, given time, also come around to the idea of having a reef and so, with leisure/tourism, the local residents and the engineer satisfied, everything was set to go ahead. With the feasibility study complete, and the funding sorted, it is now just a matter for the Council to give the final instruction so that the last stages of the project can begin. ASR, in the meantime, has formed an alliance with C&B where ASR deals with the design side of the scheme and C&B look after the construction side.



Meanwhile, in Newquay, David??s brother, Anthony, was writing proposals of his own. After watching David struggle with his reef campaign Anthony finally found an opportunity to help him. Anthony, who is also a keen surfer, was lucky enough to be given the post of Sustainable Development Officer for Cornwall County Council. It was then, with sustainability in mind, that he realised how environmentally friendly artificial reefs are and hence he got writing to some of the local councillors. The councillors showed an interest and so a series of meetings were arranged with interest growing all the time. The scheme then became considerably more viable when Gul International put some money forward to help fund a feasibility study. This in turn spurred other local companies and councils to contribute money and the project started to snowball. The Newquay Artificial Reef Company was formed to handle the money and a brief was drawn up to explain that the council wanted. In the words of the council ?¨the project must be exciting, must create more and better surf, and must not be a financial risk?Æ. A feasibility study has been commissioned, conducted by ASR in association with C&B, and the results look promising. The report addressed 3 main issues: a, can good surfing waves be produced; b, will there be any environmental problems; and c, can the reef be multifunctional. Through consultation a site was chosen that suited both the fisherman and the surfers. The site has good swell, shelter from the wind and enough access for boats to get past. The next steps for the Newquay reef are: a, cost estimate; b, talking to funding bodies; c, public consultation; d, geotechnical assessment; e, environmental assessment; and f, final design.



At present Bournemouth and Newquay are muscling for first place with both looking for the prestige of being the first artificial surfing reef in the UK. This healthy competition is backed by the fact that they are both looking like promising projects.



The increase in awareness of artificial reefs has given lead to other proposals and there is now talk of reefs at Borth, in Wales, and at Scarborough and Lime Regis in England.







Conclusion


The artificial reef scene in the UK has developed from nothing over the last 15 years and is only 40 or so years old on the global scene. Artificial reefs are still very young, and hence there is a lot of scepticism about them, but there is the driving force that is created by the air of innovation and excitement that surrounds them. It is true that more research needs to be done by independent bodies to open up this very restricted market but it is also true that there are some large consultants in this country that have the knowledge and the power to start using reefs as a form of coastal defence. Experience gained from surfing reefs constructed around the world show that the worst mistake makes made to date were the failure to account for settlement and an under-estimate in the size of reef required to have an effect on the waves. It is worth remembering that so many of today??s coastal defence schemes fail in ways so much more catastrophic than this so reefs are relatively low in risk even though they are still relatively young.



Artificial reefs are a highly sustainable form of coastal defence. They mimic natural land forms and work in harmony with natural processes to create a form of coastal defence that is not only aesthetically more pleasing but can also provide an amenity for surfers. Now that the UK is backing artificial surfing reefs it is not only pledging its support to surfers but also support to the environment as a whole.

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Looks like the local councillors are in favour of the artificial rrefs now which is good. This is an article from this weeks (April 3rd) Cambrian News:

quote:

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Artificial Reef for Borth?
Residents hope council chiefs will opt for submerged reef and not new rock groynes.Story: Patrick O'Brien

A SUBMERGED artificial reef off Borth would save the area's sandy beaches from being scarred by over 30 new rock groynes, a detailed study of protection is likely to show.

The £1 million structure, made from large geotextile bags filled with sand, would break the power of offshore waves; protecting hundreds of houses at Borth at risk of being flooded by the sea, but would be much cheaper than groynes, the study is expected to say.

In addition, the reef could provide a major boost to tourism by being 'tailored' to produce ideal conditions for surfers and other watersports enthusiasts, while creating new habitats for fish and other marine life.

The £55,000 investigation has been commissioned by Ceredigion council and is due. to be completed by early autumn.

It is being carried out by a New Zealand firm which pioneered the revolutionary method of coastal protection and has installed reefs in Australia and New Zealand, and is planning schemes for Newquay in' Cornwall and Bournemouth. Tourism interests in the Cornish resort believe the, development could make the town Europe's foremost surfing centre.

Many exisiting wooden groynes at Borth have rotted and the risk of tidal or river flooding is regarded by, the Environment Agency as, so serious that it has been opposing nearly all new buiIding development in the town. Looks like we were lucky then (Al)

Ceredigion council's head of engineering, Garfield Williams, told the Cambrian News: "The coastal defences of Borth are fast approaching the end of their effective life, and we asked our Cardiff consultants, Posford Haskoning, to look at coast-protection options along the frontage.

"They recommended recharging the shingle bank in front of Borth village and controlling this through the use of rock structures, and recharging the shingle bank along the golf course frontage and controlling a and strengthening this with the re-establishment of the breastwork and construction of rock groynes.

"But, apart from addressing coast-protection and flooding issues, we also want to enhance the amenity and recreational value of the beach and village, which is why we are now looking at a scheme which combines coast-protection and the potential of a surfing reef."

Strong backing for an artificial reef which protects Borth, while potentiallly making the town a highly profitable centre for surfing and other watersports emerged at a public meeting at which residents were asked for ideas on the town??s future.

New Zealand marine consultant Kerry Black, who heads the company working on the Borth study, explained at a later public meeting how the individually- designed reefs iwere constructed offshore, and made rock emplacements along the shoreline unnecessary. He said this week: "The reefs unify coast-protection and amenity benefits into a single structure placed offshore. "The bags are between 160 and 300 tonnes, typically 20 metres long and up to five metres in diameter, and are predicted to be stable in the eight to 10-metre waves that occur during cyclones." The sunken bags had been found to attract small fish within hours of being put in position and within two weeks became overgrown with marine organisms and plants. The investigation by his company, ASR, will report on a single reef at the southern end of Borth, although several others would be needed to protect the whole of the coastline north to Ynyslas. Council consultants Posford's proposals would see a dozen rock structures and groynes constructed along the Borth town frontage over a 10-year period, at a cost of about £3 million.

At the southern end of Borth the Posford option would see five, large v-shaped rock structures constructed lengthways along the beach, as well as a rock groyne, while at the northern end of the seafront there would be five rock groynes and another rock structure.

Together,' they would radically alter the beach and could be badly received by tourists.

The council will have to decide whether to opt for the Posford strategy, for one or more reefs, or for a combination of the two. ASR, who are working with Posford, say offshore reefs will not stop all beach erosion, and shingle banks may need to have small stones added to them.

Garfield Williams' said: "Objectives of this 'new study include to determine the best position of, and the optimum size for, the reef, to integrate the surfing reef with other proposed coastal works, and to consider the possibility of reducing or removing the need for some of the proposed coast-protection structures."

For surfers, windsurfers and bodyboarders, one or more reefs would be a godsend because of the high-quality waves which they can be designed to produce.

But Borth Surf Club secretary Richard Huxley sees the benefits rippling out into the local economy.

He says: "A reef or reefs could bring people flocking to Borth to enjoy these increasingly popular water-based activities. The economic benefits for the area could be huge."

"A reef would be a bolt-on extra to sea-defence for no extra cost. Rock would spoil the beach and would surely not be welcomed by tourists."

Borth county councillor Ray Quant said: "An artificial reef, while contributing towards coastal defence, would also be very good for the local economy."

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Oh, and heres the photo of a surfer at Borth that went with the article.

Al.

Just to let you all know that there is a meting about the future of Borth and its coastal defences this week. The results of the reef feasibility study should be announced, and all other interested parties from the other proposed schemes should be present.

its being held in the Borth Community Hall on Friday 31st Oct. at 6.15pm.

If you have any views about the proposals, then be there at make them known.

Al.

The public meeting was well attended last night, and the feasibility study that ASR have been carrying out is pretty much finished.

As usual, both ASR and especially Posfords were a little vague when it came to the actual costs, but I guess thats not really our concern. As far as the feasibility study results go, the reef would look and be positioned pretty much as I expected... Basically from above it would look like a lopsided 'V' shape, witht he pointy bit facing out to sea. The longer arm would be to the north pointing towards the beach at an angle of about 60¬?, and a shorter arm to the south pointing towards the beach at about 50¬?. The lopsided shape helps to refract the waves so that they then travel towards the beach perpendicularly which helps prevent longshore drift of the existing pebble ridge. (At the moment the waves hit the beach at a slight angle which pushed the beach material towards the north).

If they get the go ahead, the first of these reefs would be situated about 500-600m north of the cliff. And would be visible above the water for about 14% of the time (at low tides)

The study seems to suggest that the reefs would help to stabilise the pebble ridge (which is Borths main coastal defence), and would widen the beach behind the reef, but wouldn't have any effect on 'overtopping', so there would still be flooding once every now and then when a big storm coincides with a high tide. One of the main reasons for this is that at high tides, the reef is submerged under several metres of water and is therefore having little effect. Raising the height of the reef (which would be an option) could help a little with this, but would mean that the reef itself would be emergent and therefore visible for more of the time.

It seems as though the rock structures proposed by Posfords (the details of which are still a little fuzzy) would similarly not prevent overtopping. This means that whichever scheme they opt for, there will still be a need to increase or modify the sea wall at the top of the beach to stop overtopping and prevent flooding in Borth. It may not be necessary to increase its height, if adjustments can eb made to help the wall reflect the waves back out to sea.

Obviously no decisions have been made yet.

I was a little disappointed that Kerry Black went on about surfing and the benefits the reefs would have for the surf so much. In my opinion, and I'm sure the opinion of the actual decision makers and the bodies providing money for the Coastal Management Scheme, the primary concern has to be coastal protection and the prevention of flooding. Other important concerns are obviously the cost, the environmental and social-economic impacts. Improvement of the surfing in Borth is of very low priority. I wouldn't complain if the waves improved, and I'd hate it if the waves were ruined altogether by an alternative scheme, but trying to improve them is of minor importance. I think if Kerry Black had based his presentation on coastal protection, and not mentioned surfing until the very end when he tagged it on as an aditional spin-off benefit of the reefs, then the reef proposal would have been better accepted by all of the non-surfers in the room.... As it was, as I was leaving I heard a few of the non-surfers saying things along the lines of:

'well, theres only one thing for it... we'll have to take up surfing'

which suggested to me that their overview of the scheme was that it was for the improvement of surfing in Borth rather than the protection of the village.

Theres still more work to be done and I think its up to the various compaines involved to come up with a collaborative scheme that addresses all of the problems. At the moment there is no full solution, just a series of possibilites, each of which help coastal protection in one way, but not as a complete solution.

We'll have to wait and see.

It would also be nice to see a similar presentation given by Posfords, so that some of the detials of the Rock Structures could be better understood.

Does anyone else have any views on last nights meeting??

Al.

This article is on teh BBC Wales website about the reef

BBC News Website

I think they could do the project some favours if they didn't keep promoting the improved surfing conditions and concentrated more on the coastal protection aspect!

U guys, well I couldnt have thanked you more enough!!!
this is the exact topic im doin 4 AS coursework in geog!!!!! hehe

I went up2 borth sunday, chatted to a few locals filled in sum Questionairres and chatted to a few students and surfers from Aber.
Ive never really seen surfing as an appealing sport to me, but now, well then... looks mighty fun!!!

Yeah, so this cwrk is just to see if the area needs an updated coastal protection scheme.
the results of the Q were quite interestin, it was chuckin it down so i couldnt really get many filled in. Most people are for the reef and a minority would like the harbour idea.
if there are any locals who i talked 2, thanks alot, ur help was extreeeeeemly helpful!

i have only just began this cwrk, and basically each day has a new discovery,
sunday's was surfing!

If its not too much trouble could i have a few contact details like Richard Huxley or sampson guy, the fisherman?

And feel free to share surfer info 4 beginners!hehe
cheers.

If you need some more questionares answerd im sure Al won't mind if you post one on here for us to fill out, quite a few of us have been to Borth more than once.

Befs

Yeah...stick the questionnaire up here and we'll all fill it your for you.

I'll u2u Richard Huxleys number to you if you like as well... Although it has to be said that many of the locals/surfers don't necessarily agree with everything he has to say (some don't agree with ANYTHING he has to say come to think about it!!)



Hi Rich if you're reading this!!!

Al

yep, ok ta 4 ur help ppl.
i havent really had a chance 2 look over this web site props yet, so bare with me folks.

i cant believe how much info there is out there on the web on borths reef!
nah ive been up2 borth thousands of times but anyways i think another trip up2 borth is in plannin' might see sum of u guys there soon.

So Lara, do you know what the latest news on the reef is??

Are they going ahead with it, has any decision been made?

Did you actually go surfing on Sunday, or just make a decision to give it a go??

Firebird.

nope, i didnt surf.
im just kinda interested, i wouldnt mind giving it a go. i watched em a 4 a while from the top by car park. ive bin too chicken 2 try it b4 but now i reckon soon as holz are up i might actually see what its like.hehe. . .

no ive contacted the E.A (environ agency) but their busy up in N.wales with the floods at the mo.
ive got a feeling they r goin 2 go ahead with it, all arrows are pointing in its direction, so far in my op, i cant see any reason why not, apart from the fishin side. but that problem could easily be sorted.

Hi Lara...

I've sent you a u2u.... Along with my current thoughts on the 'schemes'. I don't know if they'll help you in your project, but they'll certainly give you something to think about.

To add to it, none of the current schemes will actually provide a complete coastal protection solution for Borth. The people suggesting the schemes have pointed this out themselves, as really the two main schemes only have the effect of protecting / maintaining the pebble ridge. The pebble ridge is Borths main sea defence , so this is an essential first step, but in big storms it is still breached / overtopped which results in the flooding of Borth. It would seem to me that in addition to the pertoection of the pebble ridge, solutions to the overtopping need to be found (improved sea wall etc.?).

At the end of the day its no good building the ultimate eco-friendly unobtrusive, economy improving, super surf generating sheme if it doesn't work as a coastal defence. I think that some people sometimes get so involved in trying to keep everyone happy and then loose sight of the primary objectives.

Al.

Yeah 1st priority would be maintaining and holding sand for the beach and pebbles for the ridge. The groynes seem to do this pretty well but there old and knackered now. So...new groynes - Cost loads, take ages to build, scar the beach, starve areas downcoast of material leading to increased erosion of cliff or ynslas(?)

Or,... Artificial reef - Costs less, looks prettier, decreases storm energy at beach+ sustains the pebbles/sand that are already there. But does it also decrease supply of material to the beach? Hmm.

Either way I vote for the reef. Sounds loads more exciting.

he he, looks like im gna hav 2 post that questionnaire soon. . . .

[Edited on 10-2-2004 by Lara]

Hi, I've been away for a month and understand through local rumours, that there has been some progress on the approval for the reef. Can you let me know please.

Cheers .

soz got no ideas hout,
but, thanks to help form variuos people, i scored a B in my coursework on whether an artificial reef should be constructed in Borth, and a grade B overall in my final AS result!!

the person who helped i.e. me using a quote frm them i need to say thanks, richard huxley, ta, i decided to just say that you were in favour of the idea. ta! may see u all nxt yr in aber,

Does anyone have any idea what the latest news on the proposed reef at Borth is?

Latest news (out today) is that they are going to spend an extra £100,000 on a more detailed feasibility study... If they can get the money....

quote:

---

AN artificial reef that could turn Borth into a surfers’ paradise is a step closer after Ceredigion County Council agreed to an in-depth £100,000 study.

The reef, which would become the first in Wales and one of the first in Britain, would make up part of Borth’s coastal protection as well as providing improved surfing conditions.

Two options for coast protection are being considered. It is a choice between the artificial reef with rock breakwaters and groynes, or just breakwaters and groynes.

The reef scheme would see large bags of sand lowered into optimum areas of the sea around 250 metres from the shore.

The bags would reduce the strength of waves before they reach the shore and would prove ideal surfing waves.

Consultants Posford Haskoning have been awarded a contract by the council’s Cabinet to undertake an option development study.

That study will look in-depth at the proposal for the reef and will look at how effective it will be in protecting Borth, the arrangement and size of all the construction elements and the cost and benefits of the scheme.

And Borth county councillor, Ray Quant, said he was delighted with the news that the scheme was progressing.

He said: “This hasn’t been plain sailing. There has been a lot of people who have said this will not work, but now they have accepted that it will.

“It has been accepted that the reef can be used for coastal protection as well as the recreational side.”

The reef would be constructed and placed by ASR Limited, a company which specialises in producing and siting artificial reefs.

Cllr Quant said that ASR had worked on 18 reefs around the world, and had won an award for a reef in California.

He said: “It is kudos for us in Borth to get them here. This would be the first reef of its kind in Wales.

“New Quay in Cornwall and Bournemouth are looking at getting similar reefs. I get e-mails from people down there asking how we are getting along with the reef up here. They are using us as a sounding board for this.”

Garfield Williams, the highways department assistant director, said: “This work will form the basis for a further interactive dialogue with Borth community with a view to making a firm recommendation to the Welsh Assembly Government of the preferred option for Borth.”

The council’s Cabinet agreed to back the plans for the study. The council will try to win funding from the National Assembly to pay for the study.

Copyright Tindle Newspapers Ltd 10 November 04

---

Hiya,
Only just found this site (whalst trying to do my dissertation).
Ive lived in Borth all my life, and my mum is on the Borth council and she's totaly behind the project, and the council are doing all they can to make it possible. so if I hear anything new, ill keep you all posted (although u all seem to have done some pretty good research yourselfs!)
F xXx

[Edited on 8-12-2004 by fl2115]

Has anyone heard any more news about the sea defence issue?

Any new updates on this thread? What happened to it now?

regards,
erica

Looks as though its on again at the mo.

We had a leaflet through the door yesterday saying that they council had been granted £7 million (possibly!) that has to be used by April 2011. This wouldn't cover the cost of the sea defences for the whole of Borth but would do some of it. From the cliff to the amusement arcade.

The leaflet doesn't provide info on the nature of the defences, but our local councilor was on the Welsh news last night talking about the Borth sea defences and said it would be a reef that would provide sea defences and economic benefits through enhance surf potential.

There's a public meeting on Thursday 3rd Dec at 7pm about it (Preumably in the community hall).

Al.

More on the reef from the BBC:

http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/midwales/hi/people_and_places/nature/newsid_8382000/8382463.stm

Public meeting tomorrow if you can make it.

Al.

It was a good meeting last night, here's the BBC report.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/midwales/hi/people_and_places/nature/newsid_8382000/8382463.stm

Simulation pret immobilier

im just kinda interested, i wouldnt mind giving it a go. i watched em a 4 a while from the top by car park. ive bin too chicken 2 try it b4 but now i reckon soon as holz are up i might actually see what its like

I still think this reef is a hoax. Itll be good ont eh good days, and for kiting it cud be fun to have flat water inside the barrier. However to say its going to bring surfers to the are ais bull!!!! We have some of the best reefs in the whole of the uk within 30 minuites either side of Borth, they only work a hand full of times a year however. Just because the shape of the bottom is perfect doesnt meen great surf. It wont stop on shore wind and certanly wont build its own swell.

Whats the latest with the reef? Ive heard rumours such as, its going to totally stop all surf now, and be puerly a sea defence, and no reef at all. Also that work was have ment to have commenced already, but stopped due to 2 complaints!Also that the grant money has to be spent before start of April for tax purposes?
Any actual facts out there?

It's definitely happening and work should be starting in January. I've got all of the plans and technical drawings here Shem, along with the official report so I'll bundle them up and send you a copy of them.

Here's the latest from the BBC

Al.

Hey Al - any chance you could knock up a simplified overview of the drawings - give the rest of us an idea of where the work will take place and what it might look like??

Yep, once I have Internet acces I'll put them all online and link to them.

Almost all the work is taking place south of the railway station at the moment, with several large rock grounds to replace the wooden ones currently there, along with some 'fish-tail shaped rock embankments further down the beach between and perpendicular to the rock grounds. These 'fish-tail' rock piles will therefore be parallel to the shoreline.

In addition there will be a single 'surf reef' below the low tide mark at the far southern end of the beach, in front of the outfall pipe.

Al.

Cheers Al, will be interesting to see what happens. Seriously have doubts about surf benefiting, especially as we have a huge amount of world class reefs that hardly ever work anyway. Could be interesting flat water and spear fishing though